Right now the Democratic Republic of the Congo and Uganda are responding to an Ebola outbreak caused by Bundibugyo virus, a strain with no licensed vaccine and no approved treatment. WHO declared it a Public Health Emergency of International Concern on May 17. Dr. Ashish Jha calls it one of the largest Ebola outbreaks on record and believes it spread largely undetected for two to three months before anyone caught it, with confirmed cases turning up hundreds of miles apart.
That detection lag lands squarely on hospital leaders. As Dr. Jha puts it, a two week head start on an outbreak headed for your emergency room is the difference between adjusting staffing and guidance in advance and scrambling after patients arrive. His new company, BioRadar, is building what he describes as the biosurveillance system the country needs, something closer to a National Weather Service for biological threats.
Dr. Ashish Jha, former White House COVID-19 Response Coordinator, joins Megan Antonelli to connect early detection to the cost and quality levers health system leaders pull every day. The take-home is simple and underused: prevention is not only good medicine, but it is also one of the strongest cost-control strategies in healthcare.
Highlights
🦠 On the outbreak: he expects it to get worse before it gets better, and sees a real risk of a traveler carrying it to a major city in Europe or the US. He points to last year's USAID cuts and the WHO withdrawal as reasons we have fewer eyes on the ground than we used to.
🏥 On AI and ambient documentation: his own primary care doctor uses it. The upside is real, the doctor pays more attention. But everything gets documented, the billing codes climb, and as he says, that is not saving the system money. His fix is to reduce complexity first, then deal with prices.
📋 On prior auth: payers and providers share the same frustration. Switzerland, Germany, and the Netherlands run fully private insurance with standardized billing and shared rules on what needs authorization. He argues there is a deal to be cut, less prior auth and faster payments, and everyone comes out ahead except the administrative layer.
💸 On what is coming: aging demographics and a wave of cell and gene therapies, some priced at three to four million dollars per patient, are about to put enormous pressure on budgets. His advice is to get your house in order now, before the crisis forces indiscriminate cuts.
🔬 On value-based care: once a skeptic, now a believer. He wants longer contracts, more two-sided risk over time, and programs that are physician and clinically led rather than another administrative layer.
Ashish Jha, MD, MPH, Senior Fellow, Harvard Belfer Center, Co-Founder & CEO, BioRadar
Megan Antonelli, Chief Executive Officer, HealthIMPACT Live
00:00:00 Intro: Welcome to Digital Health talks. Each week we meet with healthcare leaders making an immeasurable difference in equity, access and quality. Hear about what tech is worth investing in and what isn't as we focus on the innovations that deliver. Join Megan Antonelli, Jenny Sharp, and Shahid Shah for a weekly no BS deep dive on what's really making an impact in healthcare.
00:00:30 Megan Antonelli: New outbreaks are spreading right now. An Ebola strain with no approved vaccine and a hantavirus that has crossed dozens of borders before anyone connected the dots. Both were caught late, and that lag is expensive in lives and in dollars. Doctor Ashish Jha, former white House Covid nineteen response coordinator and now co-founder and CEO of Bio Radar, joins me to connect early detection to the cost and quality lovers. Health system leaders pull every day. The through line is simple and underused. Prevention is not only good medicine, it is one of the strongest cost control strategies in health care. Right now. As we are recording this, there is an Ebola outbreak moving through the Democratic Republic of Congo and into Uganda, a strain with no approved vaccine. And by the time anyone identified it, it had already been spreading for weeks. That gap between when something starts and when we finally see it, is the thread running through my guests entire career and through what he is building now. It's a real honor to welcome Doctor Ashish Jha, one of the most trusted voices in health care in this country. You know his work. He directed groundbreaking research on Ebola. He led Brown School of Public Health through the pandemic. And in twenty twenty two, President Biden named him white House Covid nineteen response coordinators, calling him one of the leading public health experts in America. You've seen a lot of him lately. He's been on the news on these outbreaks, and at the same time he's been running. He wrote a nine part series in the Boston Globe called The Cost Cure. On why American health care costs so much and how to fix it. Today, he is also co-founder and CEO of Bio Radar, Building the infrastructure to detect biological threats early. What ties this all together is one idea catch it early. Act before the crisis. Stop paying for the damage you could have prevented. That is a public health principle. It turns out it is also a cost and quality strategy. And that is what we're going to talk about today. Hi everybody. Welcome to Digital Health Talks. This is Megan Antonelli. And I am so honored to be here today with Doctor Ashish Jha. Doctor Jha, how are you?
00:02:41 Ashish Jha: I'm great. Thanks for having me here Megan.
00:02:43 Megan Antonelli: I mean, it is such an honor. You know you have done so much and you are just such a trusted voice in healthcare and, and certainly in public health. And I think, um, you know, you've really spent so much of your career, you know, diagnosing what's broken, working on, um, you know, the systemic problems in healthcare and of course, you know, educating and informing us all about public health. Um, and you were, you know, of course, at Brown and, uh, the advisor around, um, the pandemic in terms of where you are now. Tell us a little bit about bio radar, what you've been doing there and what made you decide to build it? Sure.
00:03:22 Ashish Jha: Thanks. Um, yeah. So I am currently a senior fellow at the Harvard Kennedy School. But but what I'm really spending most of my time doing is building a new company called Bio Radar. And let me tell you the motivation behind it. When I was at the white House, um, I got knee deep, maybe waist deep or neck deep into, uh, biosecurity and emerging biological threats. Um, we are going to see more and more engineered biology coming at us in ways that are potentially quite scary. And then, of course, there's always the risk of future pandemics and disease outbreaks. And one of the things that we concluded inside the Biden administration was that we did not have the kind of detection capabilities we needed to see and detect and respond effectively to this new generation of threats. So we started working on building that and really just kind of laying out the groundwork and planning. And, and then when the Trump administration came in, we sat down with them. We shared some of the issues. They totally get it. This is very bipartisan. And while the government continues to think about this and work on this, one of the things I came to realize was that sometimes you can write about problems, you can talk about problems, or you can just go solve them. And I, we need in our country a new generation of biosurveillance bio detection that will allow us to see biological threats early. And we decided we're going to build it. And so that's what bio radar is. We're a pretty small young startup, but we have a very clear, simple ambition, which is we're going to build the biosurveillance system. Our country needs, and we're going to get it done in the next five years.
00:05:03 Megan Antonelli: Mhm. Well, that's great, because I do feel like we've heard a little bit about some things being, you know, dismantled, not funded, things like that. So it is good to know that we can work on it, you know, both inside and outside of, of the existing system. And I think in healthcare, we found ourselves doing that more and more. Um, in terms of how does it, uh, who uses it? Who will use it? Will it be for health systems? Is it for cities, states, governments.
00:05:30 Ashish Jha: All of the above. So the whole idea, the idea is that if you can build really high quality, uh, detection tools that will let you see outbreaks early, both ones that we predict like flu every fall or ones that are unexpected, like, let's say an engineered pathogen. Um, certainly cities want it because they want to manage flu outbreaks and norovirus outbreaks and all of that. The federal government definitely wants it because they want to see engineered pathogens. And I actually think health systems want it because once we build it for health systems, having a two week early start into a disease outbreak that is going to show up in your emergency room means you can change your staffing. It means you can put out different types of guidance, and the ability to do this now is so much better because these tools have gotten so much better that I actually think we're going to have a whole plethora of customers who are going to say, can I get a data feed from this? If you build it, it's basically like the National Weather Service who uses the National Weather Service. Well, pretty much everybody does. And if you build the National Biological Intelligence Service, I think lots of people will say, can I get a data feed? Can I see what's happening in my community? I think large corporations have already had conversations with companies where like, would you ever build bio radar for us? The answer is, if we build it for a city, we can we can put in a feed for a company that will let them see what's happening in their own community.
00:06:58 Megan Antonelli: Yeah. Well, it's it's amazing. I mean, certainly as someone who is also an event professional who the pandemic really, you know, impacted across, across the board, but, you know, from a business standpoint, uh, you know, it is so important. And, you know, again, as we are here, you know, in the news every day, we're hearing about the, uh, Ebola strain that that is currently spreading in the Congo and Uganda. Tell us a little bit about, you know, what you know about that, where we are. I know there was a bit of a lag there, um, in, you know, and what could we have done if we had seen it a little bit sooner.
00:07:33 Ashish Jha: Yeah. Yeah. No, this is, uh, this is a bad outbreak. Um, there have been, this is right now officially the third largest Ebola outbreak we've ever had. I think it will very quickly become the second largest as more cases get identified. Um, my best guess is that this has been spreading for sort of two to three months, uh, largely undetected again. Detection is a huge problem, uh, everywhere, not just obviously in the United States. And the problem with detection lags. If you go two, three months, it means there are lots of people out there in the DRC, in the Democratic Republic of Congo, in Uganda who've been infected, who have transmitted it to others who are not aware of it. And if you look at where cases have been found, there are five hundred kilometers, three hundred miles in between places where we've seen this. There are a lot of people in between, a lot of folks who have probably been infected. So my take is this is going to get meaningfully worse before it gets better. If we do our job right as a global community. We will get this under control, but it's going to take many, many months. I don't see this outbreak ending anytime quickly. And of course, I also think there's a real risk that given it's in Uganda, given that it's in places with air travel, somebody's going to get on an airplane and end up in a major city in Europe or a major city in the United States. And I think that chance is real, and we're going to have to pay real close attention to that.
00:08:59 Megan Antonelli: Yeah. I mean, you know, I think thinking back to my public health days, I mean, Ebola is so virulent that in some cases it's actually better, you know, in terms of spread. I mean, it's because you can keep it under control. But in terms of where you think in terms of the government and who's working on it, are we in a good position to keep this under control? What or what can we do to make sure they're better?
00:09:24 Ashish Jha: So two things I would say. I mean, first of all, I think the cuts that we made last year to the USAID actually really have hampered us. We used to have a lot of people on the ground in DRC who were the eyes and ears of the US government. They're not there anymore because of those cuts. I think that has made it harder. We obviously withdrew from W.h.o. I've been quite critical of Critical w h o and a lot of things, but I think withdrawal from w h o has harmed us in the sense that we're not quite as engaged. America used to really, and still has incredible capacity in this area. Uh, but we're not as engaged as we used to be. Now, I will say the good news is the administration has put both a lot of money in, in the last month. Um, they've got really good teams from CDC and State Department who are working on trying to do what they can. So I do think the administration is now responding. It's just been slow, and it has not been as effective as it would have been had had we not made all of these cuts. Um, which is unfortunate because obviously it just means whenever with an infectious disease, the moment you get fall behind and start behind the eight ball, it's just much, much harder to catch up.
00:10:28 Megan Antonelli: Right? Which brings me, you know, and I, I, I could for sure talk about the outbreak all day and kind of, you know, I have so many questions, but knowing our audience and kind of where their mind is at your recent series, The Cost cure that was in the Boston Globe really cuts at some of what is so important to our hospital leaders that we talk to every day, you know, and, and what I see in terms of this, you know, when you talk a lot about, you know, kind of how it's how our current cost crisis has sort of been misdiagnosed. Um, and, you know, sort of the themes of prevention through that and, you know, it takes money to, to get to prevention, but at the same time, you know, allowing these things to happen, these crisises to happen, whether it's, you know, in a health care system or public health globally, um, the cost of those outbreaks or those crisises are far more than the prevention. So tell us a little bit about the cost cure. What inspired you to write that? Um, give our audience some overview of that, but then we can kind of get into that.
00:11:31 Ashish Jha: Sure. I'm happy to. So what motivated me was, you know, last summer and into early fall, as I was watching the national debate, we had just passed the, you know, the HR one or what people call one big, beautiful bill. And you could see the political debate in America basically coming down to people on the left saying, the only way to reduce health care spending is Medicare for all. And the people on the right saying the only way to reduce health care spending is essentially HSAs for everybody, right? Health savings accounts for everyone. And my view was actually, there's plenty of ways of reducing health care spending in America. Plenty of inefficiencies. And most of those inefficiencies, by the way, have been caused by policy makers, like policy makers, have created most of the problems that have landed us here. And so I was talking to a friend of mine, a close friend of mine from the Biden White House time, uh, who, who said, uh, you know, he said, look, political leaders are looking for ideas, but mostly what they're getting are these extreme ideas. And I said, well, I think there's a bunch of other good ones. And so I approached the Boston Globe. I had been writing a monthly column for them for a while. And usually my monthly column was like whatever was on my mind. I would just write about that and I approached them and I said, hey, well, how do you feel about a ten part series? Uh, a kind of a beginning and an end. Book ends and then eight concrete ideas. And I said, let me give you the principles. Uh, some of them are going to. Some of them are going to seem very conservative and Republican. Some of them are going to seem very liberal and Democratic. All of them are going to annoy somebody because you can't save money on health care, uh, without cutting somebody's revenue. Either their current revenue or projected revenue. Um, all of them are going to be practical. Like they're going to be things that are actually doable, not pie in the sky. And, uh, what do you think? And the globe was very enthusiastic. And so of course, uh, I put it together and, you know, and look, my view on this is that, um, health care, like we can look to other countries. First of all, we can't take any other country's model and wholesale adapt it. We have to have an American solution. There are countries that are much more market driven. There are other countries that are much more regulated. We've kind of figured out how to do the worst of both worlds. We don't have very effective markets and we don't have very good regulation. And that is, I think, a big part of our problem. So basically what I call for is more competition. Uh, if competition is not working, thinking about price regulation, uh, thinking about different ways of doing value based care, uh, big push on letting nurse practitioners, pharmacists, others do a lot more than they do now. Um, which I think is really, really important. Um, I talk a lot about administrative simplification, just the craziness of the complexity of our administrative state and how to reduce that. So I try to be very concrete and I don't just try to lay out solutions that I think federal policymakers need to make. I actually lay out things that I think states can be doing, because often it's hard to move things in Washington unless some states have done it first. And I actually think there are states that are doing some very innovative things, and I try to call those out as well.
00:14:40 Break: You're listening to digital health talks. When we return, we'll continue our discussion on how technology is revolutionizing healthcare delivery. Stay with us to hear more insights on creating sustainable, patient centered digital health solutions.
00:14:58 Megan Antonelli: Can you do a fantastic job? And I think, you know, the, the specifically the piece on the administrative waste and kind of how much we've built into that. And we talk about, you know, the increase of jobs and the growth of healthcare. But a lot of that comes down to building more layers into the system in some ways, to serve each and every one of those stakeholders that we are trying to satisfy. When we come up with these regulations and just layering administrative burden over administrative burden, a lot of the discussion we've been having lately, you know, obviously as electronic health records and then we add ambient listening to allow for, you know, physicians and nurses to have more free time, you know, and what is all of this documentation for? It is to ensure that everybody gets paid and everybody's protected. And, you know, is it really the patient care piece? I mean, I literally heard a physician say yesterday, you know, the patient care happens between the doctors and the nurses talking to each other. What goes in the record is for the payments, you know. And so when it comes to that, and you think about that administration and what can and how, um, to take some cost out of the system, what are some of the answers?
00:16:09 Ashish Jha: Well, I do think, I mean, look, I'm, I'm a huge believer in AI and I think like the ambient listening stuff. I mean, my primary care physician uses it. The two things I've noticed are he pays a lot more attention to me. That's good. Uh, the bills are he gets a code at a much higher level because everything gets documented seamlessly. That's not saving the system money.
00:16:29 Megan Antonelli: Right, right.
00:16:30 Ashish Jha: My take on this is that the first thing to do is reduce the complexity. And then the second thing to do is to deal with the prices. So if the problem is that it's leading to a lot more higher coded billing than you're going to have to deal with that more directly by reducing payments or whatever that insurers will do or Medicare will do. But, um, and AI is awesome. It's obviously not a panacea. It will make some things. As for me, the most important thing is we've got to fix payment policy, but we've also just got to reduce the complexity of the health care delivery system. And, and they go hand in hand, of course. And so as long as we're making things simpler and easier for people, then it also justifies changing prices a little bit so that you don't have t actually be paying quite as much.
00:17:17 Megan Antonelli: Right. And in terms of how the House on how to simplify, I mean, that's sort of, you know, I mean, those are systemic problems that happen at the at the regulatory level. I mean, how can we, as you know, administrators or, or, uh, even innovators kind of help get there because I think, you know, from where I sit, we're always trying to help the health systems find the technology, find the solutions. Yeah. Ultimately, it's very hard to, um, you know, kind of build the solutions into, you know, or to make the changes that are needed to reduce that complexity.
00:17:55 Ashish Jha: Yeah. I will say a couple of things on this, Megan. I mean, first thing I would say is there's actually, I think, a lot of common ground on this issue between payers and providers. Payers hate how complicated complex the system has gotten as well. And certainly providers do. And, you know, we all talk about prior auth as like one of the banes of people's existence. When I look at other countries like Switzerland, Germany, the Netherlands, they all have fully private insurance systems. What they've done is working with the government. They have actually just come up with a set of rules, set of standard billing practices, uh, the same form across insurance companies, um, set of rules about what things require prior authorization, which ones don't. And there is a way to do that. And by the way, the insurance companies in those countries love it because then they're not spending all their time fighting doctors on every single random thing. So what I would say is that if providers and payers could actually get together with the government and basically come up with some basic set of rules. Let's start with like, let's look at what Germany is doing or Switzerland is doing. It's not like the Swiss health system is like some junky health system that nobody would ever want. Like no one ever has been like, oh, Zurich or Geneva. That's a, that's a disaster. Nobody would want to get care. Like that is not a thing. Right? The Swiss have a fantastic health system. Let's start with their rules. Not that we have to follow it, but let's start there. Let's think about what we would modify. Or let's look at the Germans or the Dutch. I actually think we can make a lot of progress on these sayings. If we begin with some solutions and then ask the question, where are we willing to make compromises? I've spent because of this series, I've been spending time with people at the American Hospital Association, at Ahip, the America's Health Insurance Plan, and others, and both sides, every side on this feels pretty frustrated. And my view is if we can get people in a room together, I think there's a deal to be cut where you get administrative simplification, less prior auth, more payments happening faster. Um, and everybody is better off except for the administrative state, which we don't need it to be better off. We can cut that.
00:20:06 Megan Antonelli: Right. Yeah. No, and I think what I think is interesting is AI as they're, you know, both the payers are adopting AI to, you know, sort of enable or speed up prior auth. And, and the providers are using it to fight or come, you know, to go back and forth that we have this. In fact, we mentioned it the other day. The battle of the bots that will ultimately simplify it to what is an algorithm that eventually will stop paying to keep doing the same, same thing, right? I mean, that could in fact inform a system that then, you know, creates no need for all of it, you know, and they don't have to continue to do it on, on, certainly on every case. So getting some efficiencies out of that. I'm definitely optimistic about. And in terms of and, you know, from a public health kind of prevention standpoint and where you see kind of healthcare and the dialogue around healthcare going, um, you know, where do you think there's a sort of opportunities within that space in terms of, you know, shifting from, I think you talk a little bit of obviously about value based care and how we're going to get there. It's been a long time. We haven't gotten there. How where do you see the the power and the and the possibility of actually getting to that state.
00:21:28 Ashish Jha: Yeah. Yeah. That's a great question. Um, so a couple of things. I mean, first, I will say that, um, the pressures on the health system are about to ratchet up over the next five years for two reasons. One is the aging demographic really is now coming into its own. I mean, the number of people over sixty five is going to skyrocket. The number of people over seventy five and eighty are going to skyrocket. Uh, that, of course, puts a lot more pressure on health care spending services. But the second big force is a whole new generation of cell and gene therapies that are about to land. Some of them are landing already. They are awesome. They're highly effective. They're going to be wildly expensive. Right? The three million, four million dollar cure for hemophilia or sickle cell disease. And people can ask, how do we how do we deny people these things that are life saving? But at the same time, how do we afford it so that generates this can generate a lot of pressure for efficiency. And my general view is this is a really good time to start getting our house in order, because we're not going to be able to afford those things. And then what will happen? Because policy makers, politicians, when the pressure becomes a crisis, they never act rationally is they're going to make cuts kind of, uh, indiscriminately, and it's going to end up making the system potentially worse off. So I think to the extent that we can get ahead of it and be proactive, I think that's going to be really, really important. Um, look, there is still a lot of skepticism about value based care. I'm, I actually probably fifteen, ten years ago, I was a bit skeptical. I have become more of a believer. I know it's not hasn't been a home run, has not nailed everything. But I do think it's making progress. And I, in one of my pieces, lay out how to do it better. We should have longer contracts. We should push people towards two sided risks over time. Um, we should have it be more physician and clinically led than just a kind of an administrative layer. Um, there's a bunch of things I think we can do to make value based care better. We should be pushing on that because the alternative is we're just stuck with the same thing at the same system and constantly talking about the same problem. Except now the problem is about to get much worse.
00:23:43 Megan Antonelli: Yeah. No, I, you know, it's, it's sort of one of those things. I always wonder if it's, you know, we just called it the wrong thing and, you know, like the same thing where I feel like kind of public health is getting rebranded as prevention. And now we're talking about longevity. And most of the time we're when we're talking about longevity, we're talking about preventative medicine. And yeah, you know, people are a lot more into that. We just need a better name for what it is. Because at the end of the day, it's just a way to pay for, you know, preventative care and good care and keep people healthy.
00:24:13 Ashish Jha: Yeah, exactly. And what's interesting is I have actually never loved the term value. I mean, I use it because everybody uses it. But, you know, if you think about it, we tend to think of value as often like a shorthand for cheap. Like, you know, when you think about like, I'm a value customer, but you really usually mean is like, I am somebody. And then I often ask people, I'm like, if your mom was sick, would you want her to go to a value cardiologist or a high priced cardiologist? And most people are like, I want a high priced cardiologist, right?
00:24:41 Megan Antonelli: It's definitely, it's, you know, it needs a bit of a rebrand. But as we get there, um, you know, I, I think it is, you know, it is a model. I think your point about, you know, America needs a unique solution for, you know, our health care system because of the layers, because of the complexity, it is, it needs to be uniquely American. And, um, that is, that is for sure.
00:25:04 Ashish Jha: Um, and if you look across Europe, you know, people often will say to me like, well, why can't we do what Europe does? And I'm like, well, first of all, Europe is not a country. And second, like the UK does something very different than Germany, which is very different than France, which is pretty different from the Netherlands. Like there is no one European model. What we know is that most European countries cover everybody. We should get better at covering more people, and they do it for less money, but they all take a different approach. And so I don't think there's a specific model we should follow. I think we should take our own model and think about what can we learn from other countries, like how to reform insurance so it's more standardized. Um, like, you know, or how do we invest in primary care in the way that the UK does? Like there are places we can learn things from, but we don't want to take anybody's system wholesale and just adopt that. Right.
00:25:58 Megan Antonelli: Right. And, you know, I mean, you talk about in the series, you know, leveraging and using nurse practitioners and nurses and, and technology for more care. And, you know, I think that that is something that can be done and doesn't have to be perceived as value as long as the trust that is there that the the positive outcomes and and, and it's all meant for to improve quality not, you know, only increase efficiencies. And I think, um, you know, as long as we align on those, so we always end with sort of the positive. We have a series called five Good things. So tell me, you know, what you're most optimistic about, whether it's public health prevention, infectious disease surveillance, you know, just what, what gets you, um, you know, sort of out of bed excited about what's going on in healthcare right now.
00:26:43 Ashish Jha: Yeah. Well, I will tell you two things. Um, and, and both of them kind of really are technology based. Um, I, you know, I started off talking about threats, bio threats, infectious disease threats. We talked about Ebola. The new technologies around genomic sequencing and AI allow us to build biosurveillance and disease detection in a way that we never could have imagined five years ago. Um, I think technology is just enabling us to do things that we couldn't really imagine before. So that gets me very excited that I actually think we can build a system that protects people around the world against infectious diseases a lot more effectively than we've ever had. That's exciting. That's what I'm working on. And then the second is, you know, in the last couple, sometime last couple of weeks, we saw this, I mean, the new data, for instance, on pancreatic cancer, this new drug that doubled the life expectancy, that is just the tip of the iceberg of what I think is going to be coming for the next several years, these extraordinary therapies that are going to turn death sentences into into chronic diseases. That is very exciting. So I think this is a very, very exciting to be a time to be in healthcare and to be in public health. And, you know, last point I'll make is I was talking to a friend of mine who thinks a lot about how AI is shifting around health care delivery and both clinically and administratively. And I said to him, I said, I don't I can't predict with any certainty what AI enabled healthcare will look like in five years. I know it'll look very different. And that means there's actually an opportunity for us. All of us, you, me, people listening, uh, to figure out and imagine what should the AI enabled healthcare look like and then go build it. And that's fun.
00:28:26 Megan Antonelli: Yeah. It is, it is. It's exciting. It's an exciting time to be working on it and to see because it does, it's the technology is giving us the opportunity not to just do these Band-Aid fixes, but to really rebuild the system in a way to make it work for everybody. And I'm happy to have you at the helm of that and working on it. And it's such an honor, again, to to speak with you. Tell our audience where, uh, you know, how they can follow your work. They should all get on, find the cost cure, subscribe to the Boston Globe like I did. And so they can, they can read all of it. And, um, but how else can they get in touch with you?
00:29:03 Ashish Jha: Yeah. So let me tell you. So there are a couple of ways. I'm on Twitter. I'm at Ashish Khoja. So that's one way. Um, my cost cure series is also on my Substack for free, and my Substack is called A Moment in Health. And my company that I'm building bio detection with is called Bio Radar, and the website is bio radar, USA dot com. And but you can find me on any of these things and, and you can also find me on LinkedIn, but LinkedIn and Twitter is probably where I'm most active.
00:29:30 Megan Antonelli: Yes. Perfect. Well, thank you for everything that you do. Thank you so much for joining us. It's been a pleasure. And to our audience, if this conversation got you thinking and that is why we're here, share it with someone who needs to hear it. Subscribe to Digital Health Talks. Follow us on YouTube at Health Impact Live, or visit us at Health Impact live dot com. This is Megan Antonelli, CEO of Health Impact Live. And this is digital health Talks. Let's keep fixing health care one conversation at a time.
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